The best and the worst.

While we may launch a quest for freedom and democracy, the beneficiaries of such an action will more than likely come to look at it as an unwarranted intrusion. This may seem to us a sign of ingratitude, as though they are saying, "Thanks for cleaning up, now go away," but it seems quite fair to see a continued American presence as close to an occupation.

I spent half my childhood in France in the late 50s and early 60s; my father was in the army and stationed there for two extended tours. I know from direct experience that many French were deeply, emotionally grateful for our support in two world wars, to a depth of a feeling that most Americans cannot understand. At the same time, for the second three-year tour, to get to our house, we drove past a bridge where somebody had spray-painted "US, go home." Both reactions seem equally valid to me.

What Americans tend not to understand, at least enacted on a high political level, is that not everybody wants to be like us, and I don't see any reason they should be. We want to come in, be heroes, and have everybody love us. We may do the first with impunity, but the second and third of these points are out of our control, and as a nation, we don't like to admit that.

For reasons beyond that, involvement in Iranian affairs would be a disaster on so many levels that the thought of it terrifies me. I think Obama has had an excellent measured response, and these republicans who want to mouth off need to find a hobby. Or another hobby -- internet porn or something equally harmless.

Frank Moorman, skeptic
"what is the point of giving persons Freedom of Speech... if you then say they must not utilize same? And is not the Power of Speech the greatest Power of all? Then surely it must be exercised to the full." --Salman Rushdie

Back during Desert Storm I, a friend of my was deployed there to liberate Kuwait. She asked some of the Kuwaitis why they weren’t out cleaning up their streets. She was dutifully informed…”That’s what you’re here for…”
Went over a like a lead balloon.
A couple of years ago, my business partner and I were doing voter registration work. This was in 04. My business partner struck up a conversation with a man who fled Iran with his family after the revolution there.
He told her he and his whole family were behind Bush. When asked why, he told my business partner that Bush was going to liberate Iran. It was on all the Iranian TV here in the US.
I being in the National Guard at the time, asked if his children were going to join the military to help with the “liberation” of their home country.
“Oh no. They have jobs and school They can't do that…..”

Kinda telling. Don't ya think?

So I take this approach on Iran.
You’ve got a butt load of Iranians here. If they want their country “liberated” then they need to hope a plane to Iran.

For me it's hard not to jump on the Freedom and Democracy bandwagon. Maybe it's partly a result of a democratic bias on my part (after all, I do live in America), and perhaps because I'm a hopeful youth looking for some form of sanity in a messed up and bloody world.Maybe its because I hope for a reasonable world where the most radical aspects of religion (islamofacism, fundamentalist christianity, new age cults) don't govern everyday life.Maybe its because my current news source is CNN and Fox News (Yes, I've actually watched Fox News for coverage. For poop and giggles). It doesn't help that Iran is clamping down on both foreign and domestic journalists (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31473710/ns/world_news-mideastn_africa/) CNN has been receiving iReports from people on the streets in Iran, people on twitter were changing their locations to Iran to help anonymous protestors use twitter to post updates. People have been reporting that individuals injured during the riots have been taken out of hospitals without treatment and throwing them into prison. Christ we don't even have a steady death toll; Amnestyreports at least 15 while one Iranian blogger reported 43. I can understand Hank Fox's hesitation based upon the journalistic integrity, but the situation looks grave. It doesn't help that Khomenei blames the Zionists and the West for the riots, and says that there will be consequences.

Maybe its because I believe in the power of reason, discussion and a marketplace of ideas. Maybe it's because I'm young. But I have to hope for an end to any religious tyranny that suppresses the right of the people to assemble, to have accurate votes, to be heard, and most importantly to be free! Maybe Mousevi isn't who we think he is. But this is the will of the people. They're sick of the "status quo". Its up to us to listen. I know that anytime anybody is standing up to religious facism (be it islamo or christian) that I'm listening.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31392993/ns/technology_and_science-tech_and_...

I'm not up on the details of the story -- I've been very busy lately with a lot of other stuff -- which means I have to withhold judgment on it.

But having said that, I'm not exactly jumping on the freedom-and-democracy bandwagon either.

Years back, I had an Iranian friend in college, Behyar Goudarzian, who used to tell me how horrible the Shah was. "Ben" was here in the U.S. on a government-sponsored scholarship, so more than once I wondered how horrible the Shah could be, if he sent Iranian students here to get a free education.

A few years later, the Shah was overthrown and the Ayatollah Khomeini took over, and immediately clamped down with a repressive Islamic regime. Women who'd had the right to dress and work as they chose were suddenly subject to arrest if they ventured outside the house in unapproved conservative Islamic dress.

If I remember correctly, the Ayatollah also imprisoned or put to death a number of those "tainted" with western educations and ideas. I lost track of Ben, but I always wondered if he went back to Iran thinking to take part in some sort of glorious democratic revolution, and maybe got arrested or killed because he wasn't Islamic enough.

Likewise, Pakistan's Pervez Musharraf probably wasn't the nicest guy on the planet, but he did keep a lid on the radical Islamics for a long time.

My point isn't that dictators are good, democracy is bad, it's that sometimes these things aren't as simple as we want to think they are. Especially since what we get from American news media isn't as reliable as we might want to think it is.

Until I manage to take the time to dig into all that's going on in Iran, I'm going to clamp down a bit on my automatic impulse to cheer on the glorious democratic revolution. If it turns out that Iran is once again trading in an arguably not-so-great leader for an even worse Islamic dictatorship, however wrapped in the forms of democracy it might be, I'm pretty sure that's not the best thing that could happen.