Observations and inanities by a second-shift assistant supervisor in the Puppy-Grinding division of the Evil Atheist Conspiracy® (our motto: "Sure it's cruel, but think of the jobs!"), your host, Brent Rasmussen.
Darwin's Deadly Legacy?
Coral Ridge Ministries is offering a new DVD program titled "Darwin's Deadly Legacy," which it says
... provides a chilling look at the social consequences of Darwin's theory of evolution. The documentary connects the dots between Darwin and the deeds of Adolph Hitler.
More from elsewhere on their site:
Ann Coulter is stunned. How is it, she asks, that she could go through 12 years of public school, then college and law school, and still not know that it was Charles Darwin’s theory of evolution that fueled Hitler’s ovens.
“I never knew about the link between Darwin and Hitler until after reading Richard Weikart’s book,” said Coulter, a popular conservative columnist and a featured expert on the new Coral Ridge Hour documentary, Darwin’s Deadly Legacy, which airs August 25 and 26. Hitler, she said, “was applying Darwinism. He thought the Aryans were the fittest and he was just hurrying natural selection along.”
Coulter is among those who appear on Darwin’s Deadly Legacy, a disturbing look at the historical impact of the theory of evolution and the shaky scientific ground on which it rests.
The end pitch is interesting: (Read On)
The legacy of Charles Darwin, Dr. [D. James] Kennedy said, is “millions of deaths, the destruction of those deemed inferior, the devaluing of human life, and increasing hopelessness.” All this from a theory based on a crumbling scientific foundation—as the special makes plain.
“The time has come,” Dr. Kennedy said, “to recognize that evolution is a bad idea and should be, frankly, discarded into the dustbin of history.”
The "dustbin of history." I chuckle every time I see that, because I always hear it in my head in the voice of all those villains in Scooby Doo (And I would have succeeded, if it hadn't been for you meddling kids!):
"They shall be thrown into the Dustbin of History, and we shall RULE THE WORLD!! Hahahahaha!! TOGETHER!! Hahahahaha!!"
Well, anyway, they have some other provocative stuff you can order, in addition to this "Darwin the Evil Spiritual Master of the Third Reich" thingie. I tried to order some of it and couldn't seem to make their order form work, I suspect only because I wasn't willing to make a "donation" for the material.
I ended up sending them an email asking for help:
Dear Friends at Coral Ridge Ministries:
I'm attempting to order materials from your online site.
I'm most interested in the DVD of your new "Darwin's Deadly Legacy," detailing the direct connection between Darwinism and Hitler and featuring that delightful flower of femininity and conservatism, Ann Coulter.
The order I attempted to make had the DVD packaged with the "Evidence for Creation Book." I'd like to get the book too, if possible.
Browsing your site, I discovered a number of other programs and products I'm seriously interested in obtaining. They are:
The End Times Study Guide
Evangelism Explosion
Overheated: A Reasoned Look At the Global Warming Debate
Skeptics Answered
The Wolves Among Us
What If America Were A Christian Nation Again?
What's Wrong With Same Sex Marriage?
Why I Believe: Armed Forces Edition
Why The Ten Commandments MatterMy understanding is that, as a tax-exempt religious organization, you're not legally allowed to sell materials such as this, and may supply them only by requesting a voluntary donation from the person ordering them. In fact, your website specifically says that all prices attached to your products are "donations." Also, the order form for the Darwin DVD says "Please enter a gift amount" next to the payment window.
As an involved American, I feel it my duty to keep tabs on the activities and views of non-profit organizations such as your church, even though I don't belong to it. I'm especially interested in how your activities impact science and science education, and in examining the influence you seek to have on U.S. troops.
I am very interested in obtaining the above materials -- in fact, I hope you will consider this email my order for the materials -- but at this time, I do not wish to donate to your ministry.
Your online order form does not seem to allow for the possibility of a donation of zero dollars.
Below is my mailing address and the other mandatory information requested in your order form, which I filled out and printed for my records before being balked by its inability to recognize zero dollars donation.
I look forward to receiving the materials as soon as possible. If there is a problem with my order, please inform me immediately of the proper method for making an order without making a voluntary donation.
If you need to contact me about my order, I would prefer to be contacted by email rather than called on the phone. Otherwise, I will expect to receive the materials in the near future.
Thanks!
[name/address/phone/email]
PS: I'm seriously interested in your books and DVDs, and I really am requesting/ordering the books and DVD noted above.
It's my understanding that our historical separation-of-church-and-state setup in the United States offers churches the advantage of being exempt from taxes ... but the other side of the bargain is that churches -- having this advantage over business organizations which are required to pay taxes -- may not use that tax exempt status to compete unfairly, in the same market as tax-paying businesses, in the sale of goods and services. They can only ASK for donations, of whatever size the giver freely and volutarily chooses to give.
In my case, I am attempting to order some of their products, only those in which I'm truly interested, but also honestly and transparently declining to make a donation.
I'll keep you posted on developments.
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regardless.
regardless of all this nonsense that hitler based his plan on darwinism.... we have the fact that hitler's plan was an affront to darwinism.
no seriously. the whole idea was natural selection. that is, in fact, a very important part. improved survivability in the normal day-to-day of a species.
'course. ya know. don't really expect people like that to realize this...
Dustbin of History
Enjoyed the post. Ironically the phrase "dustbin of history" was originally used by Leon Trotsky, and later quoted by Ronald Reagan. Assume that the CRM people are quoting RR unaware that he was (perhaps unconsciously) quoting LT.
I don't think there's a tax issue here except for the donors
There's nothing prohibiting 501(c)(3)s from selling items, or giving items only when money is donated--however, if they only provide items that are paid for, the donor only is permitted a tax deduction for the amount of the donation that exceeds the value of the item. Unless you're donating to the Church of Scientology, in which case you still get to deduct the full amount, thanks to their formerly secret agreement with the IRS which was part of the settlement of their 50+ lawsuits against the IRS and individual IRS employees.
Unrelated Business Income
Actually, Jim, 501(c)(3) organizations ARE limited in what they can do for fund-raising under the concept of "unrelated business income." Quoting from one IRS publication, "Even though an organization is recognized as tax exempt, it still may be liable for tax on its unrelated business taxable income." As defined in another, "Unrelated business income is income from a trade or business, regularly carried on, that is not substantially related to the charitable, educational, or other purpose that is the basis of the organization's exemption."
So Hank is correct - churches cannot hide behind their status to avoid paying taxes that a commercial business would have to pay on a commercial venture, UNLESS the venture is exclusively related to the church's purpose. So Coral Ridge Ministries may be technically in the good by selling their silly tomes, unless they are found not to be religiously based. And yes, I checked - they are active both as a Florida non-profit and with the IRS.
As for the tax value of a donation, you are correct, you subtract the fair market value of any benefit you received (concert tickets, three-course roast beast dinner) from the amount you paid, and that is the sum you can deduct. So I wonder who determines the FMV of books like these?
And yet ...
And yet they ARE offering these things for "sale" specifically by donation. I'm betting there's precedent that says they can't out-and-out sell the things for profit.
And is it the case that both they and a potential buyer are tax-exempt? In other words, would a buyer not be required to at least pay state sales tax on a manufactured item sold to him by a church or other tax-exempt organization (assuming he is in that state, of course)?
I can see a church taking in tax-free income at a weekend pie sale at the local parish, but I have a hard time picturing it in relation to a worldwide multi-million-dollar corporate enterprise online. Unless the "payment" is noted to be voluntary, I can imagine the IRS would really prefer to treat it as a business.
Even those silly prayer shawls and similar gimmicky appeals which evangelists use to prey on the weak and the sick are accompanied by a plea for a donation, rather than an out-and-out purchase. And if anything qualified as being directly related to a church's purpose, it would be those, I'd think.
Ann Coulter is stunned. [So
Ann Coulter is stunned. [So was the last cow to go through the chute at the packing plant…] How is it, she asks, that she could go through 12 years of public school, then college and law school, and still not know that it was Charles Darwin’s theory of evolution that fueled Hitler’s ovens. [No, the question really should be: how did Ann Coulter get through 12 years of public school, the college and law school. Period. And who was the lackey that gave her all the diplomas and degrees? And, please, it was either wood or natural gas that fueled Hitler’s ovens.]
“I never knew about the link between Darwin and Hitler [No doubt. Probably because there is no link.] until after reading Richard Weikart’s book,” said Coulter... Hitler, she said, “was applying Darwinism. He thought the Aryans were the fittest and he was just hurrying natural selection along.”[No, dear heart, he was applying standard Catholic xtian thought and belief. As Darwin was a Brit and therefore an enemy, it is highly unlikely that ole Adolph had much use for his theories. See Catholicism as noted.]
Coulter is among those who appear on Darwin’s Deadly Legacy, a disturbing look at the historical impact of the theory of evolution and the shaky scientific ground on which it rests. [Ahh. How about the shaky ground La Couter’s alleged “intellect” rests? Frankly, my dog has more profound and certainly more carefully researched thoughts than she.]
Ann Coulter's attributes (or lack thereof).
"Frankly, my dog has more profound and certainly more carefully researched thoughts than she."
And is no doubt much prettier. Certainly has a superior pedigree.
tax exempt orgs can make sales
I'm not aware of any IRS regulation prohibiting 501 c/3s from making sales. However, they could be in trouble from their state Attorney General for claiming to give the materials away while really requiring people to pay. I'd send a complaint to the AG if you don't get a prompt response from these guys.
Sales
Are churches 501 c3s, though?
Also, I notice that in addition to the careful notes about donations on their site, their order form has no allowance for figuring the tax on a sale.
As to churches selling things:
Just imagine that you're in business in a small town, and you have to pay property tax, income tax, sales tax, school tax, etc., and a block away is this soaring stone castle that has to pay none of that, because it’s a church. Now imagine that your business, selling cakes, suddenly faces competition from the church, which has decided to go into the cake-selling business “for the greater glory of God.” Not only do they have the advantage of paying no taxes, they can also call on an exclusively volunteer labor force. And just possibly, because I’ve never heard of health inspectors showing up at a church bake sale, none of the health department oversight which you as a business face. (I could be wrong about this, but I don't think churches are even required to REPORT income.)
How long could you stay in business? How long could anyone? If churches decided to go into the laundry business, or the construction business, or liquor sales (or gambling – oh, wait ...), all of industry would eventually become church industry, and we’d be driving SONvees with Immaculate Conception Whitewalls, Power-O-God V8 Diesel engines and ever-full Loaves and Fishes gas tanks.
I'm nowhere near an expert on any of this, but all my life I've been under the impression that churches can't actually sell anything. They give it away for a "voluntary" donation. Of course, this mostly appears to be a transparent ruse in that only someone really REALLY poor would even ask to get it for less than the stated price. But still.
I actually do want to see the materials I requested, to improve my understanding of their organization and goals. I’m honestly curious, and I really did pick only those books and DVD in which I have an actual interest.
I openly and honestly stated my desire not to donate at this time. I expect them to honor their own promise -- and what I believe to be a legal duty -- that the prices shown are voluntary donations. I believe the huge advantages they enjoy as a tax-exempt organization come with this obligation.
I intend to persist.
A church can be a 501(c)(3)
Yes, churches can qualify under section 501(c)(3) of the IRS code. It's a fairly broad category. You can get information here: http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p1828.pdf
Nicely Done
This is brilliant, Hank. Please let us know what happens!
Could this be a potential tax law violation on CRM's part? Is there any case law or precedent set already for situations of this nature?
Existing rebuttal
There is a rebuttal to this already written. A good read, too:
Creationists for genocide
Summary:
It points out how the real motivation for Hitler was based on religion, not Darwin. Darwin and science just provided the terminology.
Ciao!
More Twisted Lies
The people who run the Coral Ridge Ministries are as vile and twisted as the rest of those twisted by theocracy. In their view, the means justifies the end, even if that means is rewriting history to support a lie.
The following are quotes from Adolf Hitler;
"Who says I am not under the special protection of God?"
"Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator - by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."
"As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice."
"By the skillful and sustained use of propaganda, one can make a people see even heaven as hell or an extremely wretched life as paradise."
I fail to see where Darwin would have had any influence on a man as ignorant and single-minded as Hitler.
However, there is one quote from Hitler which I am certain the people at Coral Ridge are using to justify these ridiculous claims;
"I do not see why man should not be just as cruel as nature."
The devout have no morality at all when it comes to telling the truth. To them, truth that contradicts their beliefs must be suppressed.
I am tired of being nice to these people, tired of respecting their immature and childish beliefs when they would just as soon have me put to death for mine. These people are attempting to dismantle the freedoms and progress we have gained in exchange for a return to the middle ages.
These people are scum, and they prey on the ignorance of others. There is a quote from Hitler that explains the Holocaust, as well as the current political situation we find ourselves in today;
"How fortunate for leaders that men do not think."
This is as true today as it was then, and I believe that there are many leaders in the modern world that herald that quote as much as Hitler did.
Fortunate for leaders men don't think
Eric-
You nailed it. You spoke about some things that have been bothering me for years. You said:
Unfortunately, you are right on. Most of us don't think. Most of us watch American Idol or enjoy the distractions of Lindsey, Paris and Brittney (the real axis of evil) rather than pay attention to what our elected leaders are doing in our names. It kills me when I think about how easily persuaded Americans were to invade Iraq. Some average used car salesman like Bush comes along, preaches a little fear, and the next thing we know, Saddam becomes public enemy number 1 to America. People are sheep.
Here is another quote from that era that is just as relevant today as it was 60 years ago:
"Naturally, the common people don't want war, but they can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. Tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and endangering the country. It works the same in every country."
-Herman Goering (Hitler's Reichsmarschall at the Nuremburg Trials)
Right now, we are seeing the beginning of the drum beats of a war with Iran. I am noticing more and more politicians become outraged that Iran is working against our interests in Iraq. Iran is working towards their own interests. No shit. Did we expect Iran to work with us after we demonized them by naming them a terrorist state? Did we expect Iran to work with us after we threaten them about having nuclear reactors? Did we expect Iran to work with us after we attempt to financially bully them in the UN by way of embargos? I am afraid war with Iran may be inevitable given the un-thinking nature of the average American.
Dirk
Kiss your economy goodbye.
Dirk, you're dead right about people not thinking. I'm working on a longer post on that topic for later today perhaps, from a personal perspective.
As for Iran - any significant attack by the US on Iranian soil will mean a collapse of the world economy. Because Iran has the ability to shut down a sizeable portion of shipping through the gulf, meaning that oil markets would go nuts. Think for a moment what would happen if oil was $300 a barrel. It'd mean another "Great Depression" here, at the very least.
Jim Downey
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Like Science Fiction? Read my novel, Communion of Dreams, for free.
what an AWESOME post. if I
what an AWESOME post.
if I was even remotely religious, I would get down on my knees and thank Koresh I finally found a site that thinks like I do. I watched the idiocy of the CRM program. The good doctor kept repeating the Darwinism "is crumbling", even though a cursory knowledge of current scientific thought would reveal that biological evolution is one of the most proven and solid scientific theories that exists today. But Coulters contributions to the film were nothing short of stupid. ALWAYS REMEBER "doctor" Kennedy, whenever you want to convince morons to doubt science, trot out a right-wing luny columnist with less science training than my pet rock. Makes you that much more convincing..........
penny for thoughts
I wonder, would the amount of $0.01 be sufficient for their donation? As you say they cannot technically sell stuff to you. I've seen this same problem with bootleg exchanges, typically they ask for an amount equal to the cost of the disk + shipping and handling.
ugh, this sounds familiar
Ugh, this was one of my ex-wife's hang-ups/obsessions that led her from a wishy-washy agnosticism back to the fundamentalism of her youth (and indirectly to the dissolution of our marriage); she was positively convinced that "Darwinism" and "Social Darwinism" were the same thing (they're not), and no matter how many times I tried to patiently explain the difference, she wouldn't listen. This was her pet "idee fixee" and she wouldn't be budged from it.
I'm still bewildered at times reflecting on how we ever hooked up to begin with, since I never made any secret of either my atheism nor my marxist outlook on things.
apropos of "Dustbin of History", RR may not have known the phrase comes from Trotsky, but his NeoCon handlers certainly did, many of them ex-Trots themselves. When Trots go bad, look out.
I sent them an email similar
I sent them an email similar to yours and they are sending me out free copies..
A couple of local businesses
A couple of local businesses sponsored this program to run commercial free down here recently. It is a complete pile of crap, full of half-truths, quotes mined from real scientists, and outright lies. I wrote a letter to the editor of our local paper and they published it: http://butchbailey.com/?p=405
Gregor Mendel
Seems like Hitler's work would be much more easily related to Gregor Mendel, the Austrian monk who first observed the effect of genetics on peas, than to Darwin's theory.